Season 3
39 Minutes

E92 | Sam Yau & Sophie Rouméas | Two Souls In Love

Sam Yau is a retired business executive who splits his time between managing his investments and writing poetry. Sam has reinvented his life several times - from being a 6-month-old baby on a refugee boat from China to becoming the CEO of a billion-dollar corporation and eventually the Chairman of the iconic Esalen Institute in California’s Big Sur.

Sophie Rouméas is a French writer who loves to use words and her voice to guide people during meditation and hypnosis sessions. In 2021, Sophie wrote an anthology, "J’ai vécu la même chose que toi," with 12 co-authors. It celebrates the resilience of young women who have recovered from breast cancer and offers a message of hope to the families affected by this ordeal.

As Sam and Sophie became two souls in love, they co-authored a book of poetry about the experience, aptly titled “Souls in Love.”


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These show notes come via the service. The transcription is imperfect. But hopefully, it’s close enough – even with the errors – to give those who aren’t able or inclined to learn from audio interviews a way to participate.

Sam Yau  00:00

I will define so it’s the power of us, is already connected to the vastness of the Divinity, of which we are part. So we are divine already that spot is there. So whenever we feel we’re connected to something bigger than ourselves, whenever all by the vastness of the nature when you look at the star constellation at night, we had that feeling of vastness. That’s also

Achim Nowak  00:37

Hey, this is Achim Nowak, executive coach and host of the MY FOURTH ACT  podcast. If life is a five act play, how will you spend your FOURTH ACT? I have conversations with exceptional humans who have created bold and unexpected FOURTH ACTS, listen, and to be inspired. And please rate us and subscribe on whatever platform you are listening on. Let’s get started.  I am so very happy to welcome Sam Yau and Sophie Rouméas us to the my fourth act podcast. To Sam Yau I have known for a while and Sophie I just met a few words about who Sam and Sophie art. Sam Yau was a retired business executive splitting his time between managing his investments and writing poetry. That sounds pretty good to me, Sam. Sam has reinvented his life several times from a six month baby on a refugee boat to a penniless student from a distant land to the CEO of a billion dollar corporation to the chairman of the iconic Esalen Institute in California. Now, Sophie Rouméas is passionate about words, and their ability to trigger emotions, memories and thoughts. She lets them infuse her work as she guides people with her voice during meditation and hypnosis sessions. She was born in the French Alps. And in 2021, she wrote a French and anthology with 12 Incredible co authors, titled under this title GV, Gu, la meme shows catwalk which translates into AI to lift it. Welcome the avenue.It’s so nice to have you here. Sam and Sophie have written of poetry together called souls in love. And February is often considered a special month of love as Valentine’s Day. Before we get into this marvelous book, I’m always curious, I have a question for each one of you. And I don’t care in which order you answer it. Okay. But when you were young growing up, and I know you’ve come from different parts of the world, and you know how parents ask us, like, what do you want to be when you grew up? What were your thoughts about who you thought you would be when you grow up?

Sam Yau  03:13

What I have been doing with my life has very little to do what I wanted to do when I was young, as a child. But I do remember one thing that connects the past to what has happened. And that is I read a book called a pilgrimage, a Christian book, I have in my mind, their life is a journey. I always wonder what the journey is about. And in my case, there appear to be there multiple twists and turns. So I’m kind of looking back. And my job is to just see what’s unfolding and go with the flow, and then reinvent myself when there’s opportunity for me to just to live a fuller life.

Achim Nowak  04:02

Thank you, Sam. What about you, Sophie?

Sophie Rouméas  04:05

Well, when I reflected about this question, it brought me back to I think I was 13 years old. I was at school. We were having physical activities, and I will watching people moving in this big room, you know with Kemet, gymnastic and, and I was wishing one day, I’d like to be a choreograph. So of course, I met some some dance class as well. But having this ID was in me at that moment was kind of surprising. And strangely enough now, but I’m working also with a tool named systemic constellations. We do study the movement of people in a place in a physical place to help to move a perception of our place in the family, in this society as well. So that’s the memo that came back to me thanks to your question.

Achim Nowak  05:00

I live in the Miami area. And I have a whole bunch of friends who are very interested in Family Constellations study Family Constellation. So what you mentioned immediately made me think of the people who I love in my life who are really studying that. And the idea of motion and movement makes so much sense to me. If I understand it correctly, you two met in a workshop event at the Omega Institute, which is a really well known place for, I would say, advanced, sophisticated spiritual exploration and human growth development. Did I get that right?

Sam Yau  05:40

Yeah, yes, perfect. Perfect.

Achim Nowak  05:42

So I have warned you, because in souls in love at the beginning, you write poems about initially meeting each other. I’m going to read a little bit from something that you wrote, Sophie, it’s a poem, the beginning of the book, you have no idea what I’m reading right now. So you’re going to be very surprised. These are your words. And then I would invite you to reflect on on what they mean to you today, as you and Sam have embarked on, on a journey together. naked before you, my soul comes forward without fear. I know my torments my strengths, my weaknesses, my light, and my mission. I anticipate your questions, even the ones you want to ask. I don’t know everything about you. But I know enough to recognize you. I first met you in dreams and meditations. And today, in this past life workshop, in this reality, it is not your face that is familiar to me first. It is the essence of your soul. And I’m gonna stop there, there’s more to this poem. But as you hear these words, which you wrote, and they take you back to first meeting, Sam, what else would you like to tell us about this experience of meeting Sam?

Sophie Rouméas  07:09

This is a very intimate moment where I mean, when we met, I had absolutely no idea myself what could unfold from our accountant. There was just something driving me to listen to him. And his voice, I’m very sensitive to the vibration. And something in me would tell me that that is advice. I could not say I know this voice, but this vibration is coming yet somehow to me. This is part to me of your sense of a soul. We may be a man or man. But there is a vibration that comes from the way of expressing so not only the mental state, but not only the emotional state that was sold state, the soul level in order for us to travel time space. This vibration to me was enough. And I feel it right now in my voice. Because it brings me back to this emotion in this vibration. I’m familiar with it. And it led me to want to learn much more about some first was not about being in love as a sense of man, woman, human beings being in love together. It was I want to learn about I know him somehow I want to learn. How is it but he popped up into my life. Yeah.

Achim Nowak  08:33

Beautiful. Sam, I’m going to read something you wrote, okay. The day I met you, I was so taken by your eyes. They were all I could see two brilliant rays of light reaching deep into my soul. At the end of that fateful day, I was still dazed by the encounter. That night in my dream as to the loan on a beach, under a silvery Full Moon against a starless night sky. I gazed over the horizon, the oceans far away, waves surged taller and taller, roaring toward me. I had no fear. Again, there’s more to the poem. I stop here. Would you just talk a little bit about that day, the eye is the experience.

Sam Yau  09:29

Oh, yes, that pretty much describe the enormous feelings I have, which is totally disproportional to the time when we will each other which is just an hour to talk about when with my feeling without knowing why. And this is feeling something I never experienced before. I would say I recognize it as a universal that’s the love that kind of branches into the love have a specific relationship, whether it’s parent and child, a brother and sister lovers have a differential is something that I recognized, I was going through a very traumatic period because of my son’s suicide. And this particular feeling actually killed me, is totally unconditional. And I say it’s so beautiful, it just expand my heart, I have no desire to have a romantic relationship at that time. That’s amazing. I know, I got to know. I want to, to be a friend with her. That’s how it started. But of course, it eventually materialized as I love us.

Achim Nowak  10:46

The book is called souls and love in even in his early poems. For us the word soul. I’m very curious. And this may be an impossible question, but I’m going to ask it anyway. Sophie, Sam, What’s your understanding of soul? What does soul mean to you? How do you experience soul?

Sophie Rouméas  11:09

Well, as we think about the book, Soul is enough. I mean, certainly every people who need and who have a love relationship, this is at a soul level. And then maybe what can differentiate one loves to be to another one, I mean, no one is better than another one, but maybe the consciousness, the awareness, we have about the other one about ourselves, the depth of what we feel, what we want to share, maybe can gradually lead us to what a soul which is taking over dimensions of the other one, and of oneself. So we’re not limited only by the physical desire, neither by the emotional desire, this is also the kind of spiritual connection, which is not always wanting, of course, in the love, we want to also have a physical contact, we, we want also to have a good emotion. And also we want to learn more, not only about the person, but also the inclusion of all the dimensions of a person, the family, maybe the ancestors. So this is no limitation in time, space. I mean, we are in the present moment, we love we enjoy this present moment, and we expand. So it is including every aspect of physical, emotional, intellectual, and spiritual being.

Achim Nowak  12:34

What would you like to add to that Sam,

Sam Yau  12:37

I will define so the stockpile of us is already connected to the vastness of the Divinity, of which we are part. So we are divine already that spark is there. So, whenever we feel connected to something bigger than ourselves, whenever, all by the vastness of the nature, when you look at the star constellation, at night, we had the feeling of vastness, that’s also the feeling came from us so and when we’re looking for meaning and purposes, that came from the souls longing to direct us to find ourselves purpose. So when two people meet at the soul level, there’s a vastness that you want to be intimate with your partner, and all level. And I would say, for me, I come to learn through my life, that the essence of a relationship lovers relationship is intimacy at all level. And the soul will direct us to expand the intersection of two vast universes. And when we feel that we know what level

Achim Nowak  13:57

I chuckled, because as I’m listening to you both I feel like you’re both answering this difficult question, like poet’s. But your answers were just really beautiful. I liked it for a moment is talking about just the process and mechanics of two people who sold and love writing a book together. And this is what I see. But it could be wrong, as I read your beautiful book. It alternates between poems that you wrote Sophie and poems that Sam wrote. So my sense was that you decided to write your own poems. You each have different writing styles and different voices. You didn’t write a poem together, but you created something larger and more cosmic to use your language. Same by writing your individual poems. But did you write them at the same time? Did you sit in the same room or at the same beach as you wrote? Did you go off and write them on your own and then show them to each other? Just describe the process of Two Souls in love writing book together.

Sophie Rouméas  15:03

Thank you to ask this question. We made everything you said. So. So there was no, we did not put a recipe, you know, saying, Okay, we will really do this way we will structure, it really started spontaneously, somehow we felt we were driven to write together. So it started to melt in and to pop up into our thinking a few months ago. And at one point, we decided to make a trip in France romantic trip in between Paris and south of France. And also with adding a lot of art in it. We knew we wanted to start to write a book, and it all started in a time, you know, we are the notebooks and we were in between basically and saying, Okay, what do we want to write about? And we started to define very spontaneously, that we wanted to speak about love. And not only the romantic love side, but also you know, why not speaking about the misunderstanding possible in love relationship, and at all possible levels. So we shared some words, some thinking, and some topics. And we started to back I think, the first one image way from my little town and then the antsy to Paris. One day, we would say, Okay, today, maybe it’s the day to speak about that topic. And we would take the time, and then to read to each other what we wrote at the end of the time. Yeah, what do you like to earn?

Sam Yau  16:38

Sophie was the first one to recognize me as opponent. That’s the connection. I recognize that and then I very soon, well, maybe not to six months, I realized. She also wrote beautiful poems, I say, Wow, okay, this collection, maybe why we are together. And I feel strongly that we should write poetry together. And what will be the natural topic for the poetry is why we just became a lovers. The feeling is tremendous, is like a honeymoon on our trips, the best then, and they continue to extend, still going on today. And we also decided we want complete separate voices, we though we’d sometimes talk about topic and share a little bit about what we think about it, and then we go off, but we pull off to write it on our own based on our experiences, but we can write together in a campaign, sometimes we go to the cafes, on our trips, we just sitting next to each other, she writes hers, and I write mine. And so we feel we have so much emotional feelings of love. That’s really the feel for the poem is really leverage that feeling to write this book.

Achim Nowak  17:59

What I would like to add to that, however, as a fellow writer who’s written a bunch of books, you both write about your experience of love. But if you two were horrible writers, these would be horrible poems, and nobody would want to read them. But you are highly skilled poets, which is with very distinct voices. This is one of the things I just love about your book, that you’re not trying to have one voice. So the uniqueness of the voices. And the difference in which we write, you’re right, which feels very hate us. We’re very authentic to who you are. It’s an overused word, but that’s what I felt was especially moving to me. Now I want to build on what you just asked. Because I not many people get to have a love partner. And you write poetry to each other as your relationship evolves. What was it like to have your partner read a poem to you that she or he had just written to receive the words like that experience to us?

Sophie Rouméas  19:03

Oh, wow, it’s each some, some would read a new poem, I would close my eyes and feel what he says to feel so the emotions are so vibration. So it’s a kind of ritual it became a kind of ritual sometimes we will not be together we will be in two sides of the glove of the sun would be in California would be in France, and we would read a new poem we just both so it’s a ritual it’s the kind of it’s like a fest know where we sit comfortably and one would say now close your eyes. So this really is part of a fest, it’s part of a celebration.

Sam Yau  19:45

I will say it just like Ascension. When we hear the lovers Poland is like all the chakra you know, the heart and the mind everything expand is we feel very blessed that we You know, happen to fall in love with another poet who can who can express soap deliciously about the feelings. It’s it’s really coming at us deeper and deeper and deeper beyond what I can describe

Achim Nowak  20:19

a word from your sponsor, that’s me, I invite you to go to the website associated with this podcast Fourth, you will find other equally inspiring conversation with great humans. And you will also learn more about the my fourth act mastermind groups where cool people figure out how to chart their own fourth acts, please check it out. And now back to the conversation. Part of what I really adore about your book is has different sections and different sections have different thematic titles. And I want to just mention three of the sections right now not read the poems. But I want to invite you just reflect on the titles themselves and what they mean for you. And I’m gonna start with one that’s later in the book called love and healing. And what really touched me I’m a mature person. And what I, what really resonates with me in your book is you are two people who have experienced love before, you’ve been hurt before, life hasn’t always been rosy or easy. And we bring all of that to a new connection with another soul. And I felt like in love and healing, you really address the past that you bring into this love connection. You mentioned earlier, Sam, that there was some healing involved, I’d love to hear from both of you like what’s the healing part in this and also what is what is maybe sometimes not easy. When you encounter the person’s past.

Sam Yau  21:58

Love is the most powerful healing way. So when two people I love talking about the love that is close to the more unconditional to the higher aspiration of Love heals everything, and you can extend the healing to the past. So I will say when I’ve applied math, Sophie, before we became lover, which is three years later, the feeling of that love is already healing my trauma. For my son’s suicide, I played a very important role. So the most important thing about healing is to be to be loved again. And then when a couple when they have issues they have conflict, they may have some residuals in the in the relationship accumulate. If they do not fully express it, it stay there. But we love it, especially with the physical intimacy, the plane can Penny burn the residual off, then you can start fresh again, that’s how and honeymoon can be extended. It just need to continue to clear anything that you know, still resigned you and then and then you’ll know your lovemaking will be just clear. There’s no clouds in the sky is like a blue sky, you just bring you lift you up to Elevation I’ve never healed before.

Achim Nowak  23:25

When you said the honeymoon, it can be extended. I really thought oh, that could be a workshop you too can teach the honeymoon can be extended. Having some healthy love and healing what does that mean for you?

Sophie Rouméas  23:45

Well, this is the gift of love. I mean, we may not intend to heal or to be healed by the other one. But this is the natural gift of love is that we have this chance to be you know, naked in front of a another soul another human being. And when we feel love, we feel acceptance, obviously so so a big word. So we accept each other. So we accept to be see to see and to be seen as we are we don’t need to wear a mask. We don’t need to have a makeup. I would say something like that. So we are not perfect. I mean, if we were perfect, we probably be in another dimension. So we are here to continue to learn to grow. And so that’s the gift. We have our past we have our own wounds, some on the way to be healed. And when we hear the other one we can continue to learn how to be crystal clear. Learn how to not transfer on the other one. And not that we are the ones when it’s on us the past past relationships past misunderstandings, details require patience acceptance, of course love so I feel that the healing is the gift Hello, is not what we searching. This is the result of

Achim Nowak  25:08

what you just said makes me think of one of my favorite words that you both play within the book is the word garden, and you have a section called Love garden. And garden has, for me very personal connotations. Entering the garden going back to the garden, it has so many meanings, but it had been since you to connect it to love, what’s the connection of love and garden and the meaning of the word garden and all of that for you.

Sam Yau  25:40

Garden is used to symbolize in subjective, well, that’s created by two people. And they develop specific language, they develop the way they interact with each other. It contains the feelings for each other, the embrace the acceptance, and everything they experienced together, whether positive or negative. It’s continuing to shape this garden. And I would say the main thing about this garden is the different kind of intimacy. And though I use 1000 flavor of intimacy, which to me is the core of romantic love. So it’s up to the couples to say, we want to keep this garden beautiful, this garden is totally in our inner world, and how well we’re able to stand challenges the outside world, which sometimes causes conflict and disagreement in us. That degree, we can resolve what the challenge from the outside depending on how strong how beautiful this garden is. So it’s our job to make sure that this is a beautiful garden, when it’s from the inside, they will be reflected in our our interactions, which will be filled with love and intimacy. And so this garden to us is what we need to protect. And that’s the secret of extended the garden.

Achim Nowak  27:12

Sophie, meditate on the word garden for us, please.

Sophie Rouméas  27:16

Yeah, so garden, we all have an inner garden, Sam in his first book has a beautiful poem about the inner garden. And so I feel when we meet someone we have strengths to, to to further the garden, or the other one, which is already amazing time is to learn how about the other one, how he or she be, you know, the beliefs, the how he shapes his life or her life. And so when we combine our garden together, we create rituals to enhance our lifetime together. And this is so the combination, so very still, you know garden, we want to be happy to be with ourselves by our own. And we also try to together at the same time space, and when we can make it beautiful. And when it’s not beautiful. Sometimes it can happen, you know, the sky is not always blue without clouds. So we can maintain it, how we can sometimes plant new seeds. So for us poetry is part of creating a new space in the garden. Each poem can be a new flower. And each book can be a new tree, why not? So how we find things together to continue to create co create, also, spatter the garden.

Achim Nowak  28:42

ask both of you in advance to think of a poem from your book that that you would like to read a little bit from on this podcast. And I’ll let you know that I’d love for you to read a liberated poem. And also, then talk a little bit about why you chose that poem and what special meaning that poem has for you. So the floor is open, it doesn’t matter who starts

Sophie Rouméas  29:07

I chose one poem, one of my shortest one. So it’s funny because sometimes he would laugh with some you know, I can take 20 lines that he may combine in two lines. So but I chose a short one, and I think it is, it does also talk about this idea of to create the basis of Queensland law, and religion. The loving nature of a romantic relationship has the power to elevate the human spirit towards the divine, within the soul, seeded with particles of every possibility. Pure matter of love assembles and intensifies until the birth of unity Mine, I welcome your religion with no doubt, or concern, because I know we both answer to the same divine those love, respect and creation

Achim Nowak  30:18

exquisit. And I feel like there’s there’s no reason to explain it because it says at all, I think there was nothing else that you need to add to it. I fully feel like I got it and I received it. So thank you. Thank you this year, Sam, what would you like to read to us

Sam Yau  30:35

from the inner garden, your garden blossoms in 1000 frequencies of intimacy. That is the essence and purpose of love. And the surest way to ask to see that seeds DNA come from the melding of both your essences as you flourish and grow into better versions of yourself. So will your garden grow into a more romantic versions of itself, as soil is not tilted from shallow premises, but a deep commitment to one another, as water flow from hot metal tenderness, pure loving, presence, deep sharing and vulnerability with one another. Intimacy and passion reinforce each other in an endless circuitry.

Achim Nowak  31:33

So one word stood out from me from this poem, and it’s a word that hasn’t come up so far in our conversation, because you talked a lot about intimacy before Sam. But I were I heard the word ecstasy for the first time. So as we complete what both of you maybe contemplate on what ecstasy means to you, and how you might experience it.

Sam Yau  32:01

Cancer acetate as to see is the joy of union. The union and the union is derived from intimacy, all level, I will say when I am in a sec, when I would go with Sophie, I often was in a semi auto state. So it’s really an uplifting of the spirit to a level that normally not experienced when I’m alone. So I can distinguish that feeling which I never had in my previous relationship.

Achim Nowak  32:46


Sophie Rouméas  32:49

one go to Yeah, it’s tasty. Solar power is also leads me to this word harmony. It is also this feeling that everything is in the right place at the right time for robots reason. So ecstatic for me is also feeling in harmony with everything, everybody. So it’s not a lifetime of extensive, there are pure moments of grace. And these moments are so precious that we just want to taste them, to feel them to love them to cherish them. So yes, XYZ at these moments of pure grace,

Sam Yau  33:33

I’m going to add STC also. I know I mean, as I say, when I feel I can love everyone, everything in the world. I know. I’m feeling the taste of divinity. And that’s the power of a lover who’s can be connected at all levels.

Achim Nowak  33:56

I want to close with a question that I tend to ask in all my podcasts. I’m putting myself in your shoes and I don’t know how I would answer it. But it is. As you look to the future, both individually and as two people traveling together. Other hopes, other aspirations other longings are the things that you would love to explore that have not occurred yet. Part of spiritual teaching is to be in the moment and not have any of this. But many of us humans also sometimes have a future orientation. I don’t know how you answer that as to in soldier love. It’s your book and it’s your story. How do you handle thoughts of the future wishes desires?

Sophie Rouméas  34:52

So as you said, I feel already so much blessed by the present time. So I’m so happy about it. I know we like to continue to write poetry together on different topics. And also, because of this love, Liza. So to have some kind of metaphysical experiences, to me, it’s very obvious. Sometimes I have transcendental moments, not undoing the intimacy, but also doing some kind of meditation. So while we continue our rituals, I intend to continue to keep his blessings moving forward, and to also to garden Well, our garden, and to continue to seek for more harmony, for me, and for my people extending the circle of harmony. So this is kind of global things. But to me, it has been a little step every day is a little step around it.

Sam Yau  35:48

Yeah, two months ago is something that came to me, it’s revealed to me by my soul, in those very strong signal that we are going to write the next book of poetry, on trauma and healing. In our life experiences, they might send suicide that can be to study a lot about, you know, the suffering and the human will. So that’s our project. And we hope to have another book on trauma and healing ladies souls in healing. We’re very excited about it, we are totally driven to write another book, which hopefully will help other people. And after that, I think the cycle will continue. And that’s why it is important for us to continue to grow so we have experiences and insight to share with the world.

Achim Nowak  36:43

Thank you, both of you for the gift of this conversation. Where would you like to direct folks who want to know more about your book where they can find it? Do you have a website, this is the time for you to let our listeners know.

Sam Yau  36:59

sOAZ love can be found on in all versions hardcopy so copy, you know, Kindle and you will be in audio form as well. My website is Sam Yao poetry, and I’m also on social media and Danielle poetry. You can find me on Instagram and Facebook. Sophie,

Sophie Rouméas  37:22

yes, the book will still be known to you, as you said some Yeah. And so I just share some pieces of poetry on social media with this name, which is travel me like poetry. One day, you know, okay, I’d love to travel, you know, like, like a poetry and live said, Okay, let’s travel each other. And I think that will become you know, my motto in life is why not trying to travel life like, which we push with everywhere.

Achim Nowak  37:58

On that note, poetry is everywhere for all of us. To be continued, but for now, just really thank you for this conversation and continue to be well and enjoy life. Oh, wow.

Sophie Rouméas  38:11

Oh, wow. Visually, okay.

Achim Nowak  38:15

We’ll see. To see. All right. Like what you heard, please go to my fourth And subscribe to receive my updates on upcoming episodes. Please also subscribe to us on the platform of your choice. Rate us, give us a review and let us all create some magical fourth acts together. Ciao


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