Season 1
44 Minutes

Ep. 6 | Trisha Lewis | How I Stepped Into FLOW and Unsquashed Myself


Trisha Lewis, 63, is a British actress, writer, and communication consultant who champions confident authenticity. When she wasn’t getting the acting parts she desired, Trisha wrote her own one-woman shows and began to tour. At a time when some people plan retirement, Trisha launched a communication consultancy. Trisha hosts the Make It Real Podcast and just released her book “The Mystery of the Squashed Self.

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Season 1 | Episode 6 | 44 minutes

Trisha Lewis, 63, is a British actress, writer, and communication consultant who champions confident authenticity. When she wasn’t getting the acting parts she desired, Trisha wrote her own one-woman shows and began to tour. At a time when some people plan retirement, Trisha launched a communication consultancy. Trisha hosts the Make It Real Podcast and just released her book “The Mystery of the Squashed Self.”

What are all the ways in which we squash ourselves? How did Trisha Lewis fully claim her unique voice and vision? How do we find our communities of joy?

www.trishalewis.com

THE IMPERFECT SHOW NOTES

To help make this podcast more accessible to those who are hearing impaired or those who like to read rather than listen to podcasts, here are our show notes.

These show notes come via the Otter.ai service. The transcription is imperfect. But hopefully, it’s close enough – even with the errors – to give those who aren’t able or inclined to learn from audio interviews a way to participate.

SPEAKERS

Trisha Lewis, Achim Nowak

Trisha Lewis  00:00

I was described as being shy as I was scrolling through my 12 1314 I actually now don’t think that I was shy. I think that was exactly what happens when you squash yourself. And you’re so confused about what you’re allowed to let out that you end up in an internal battle. And in fact, the outward display does look a bit like you’re really shy.

Achim Nowak  00:29

Hey, this is Achim Nowak, executive coach and host of the my fourth act podcast. If life is a five act play, how will you spend your for that? I have conversations with exceptional humans, who have created bold and unexpected fourth acts, listen, and to be inspired. And please rate us and subscribe on whatever platform you’re listening on. Let’s get started. I am so happy to welcome Trisha Lewis to the My fourth act podcast. Trisha is an actress, a communication coach for small businesses. She hosts her own very cool, Make It Real podcast. And she just released a marvelous book called The Mystery of the Unsquashed self. And I know we’re going to talk about it. Trisha has created a fun and quirky Alter Ego called investigator Louis. And she uses investigator Louis to deliver some of her very powerful communication messages. But most importantly, the reason I wanted to invite Trisha as a guest is Trisha, you’re 63. Now we claim our age in the fourth act. And my sense is that just in the last few years, you have claimed your business identity in a new way. You have claimed your authority and confidence in a new way. And you’re playing to have a bigger impact in the world. And that story of how you got there is really interesting to me. So welcome, Trisha.

Trisha Lewis  02:17

Ah, I’m just thrilled. That’s it. What can I say? I think that our whole journey together, it’s been very interesting the way we connected in the first place, the sort of synchronicity and sort of accidental nature of it all. And yeah, and here I am, it’s great.

Achim Nowak  02:34

I wasn’t gonna go there. But since you brought it up, how did we accidentally Connect? Why don’t you tell you a side of this.

Trisha Lewis  02:43

It’s a lovely story, actually, because I set up my coaching business just over four years ago. And I felt instinctively that I should be doing videos because with the actor kind of speaker background, it seemed natural. And I was finding my feet with how I was putting my message out there. And I had done some readings from some books and was talking about kind of engaging an audience and energy and all that rest. And I had actually read at least one I think two extracts from either power presenting infection, one of your lovely books, which I had way before I had met you. And you then when we connected on I think LinkedIn or Twitter, but I think it was maybe Twitter, but we connected. And then retrospectively, you spotted one of these videos, and I thought this is great, because he knows that I have not done this just to impress this, this was just me loving these books and sharing this stuff. So that was a great start, I thought.

Achim Nowak  03:54

Thank you for sharing that story. What I love about writing, since you’re just getting your first book out, and we’ll talk about it is books have a life beyond the immediate life that we know and that the surprises when other people discover us our stories and our messages. And that’s one of the beautiful gifts of playing in a different way. Before we get there. Who did Trisha want to be as a young girl or teenager? What were your dreams? What did you want to be when you were growing up?

Trisha Lewis  04:32

The first bit will sound as if I’m just making it up. And it sounds a bit cliche, but it’s true. I have a memory. Who knows is it because somebody told me about it, but I think it’s a memory. I must have been about five? Yeah, random my best friend’s house and her mother. You know, we just have one of those old fashioned teas of boiled eggs and salad and things like that and her mother asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up. And I said, I want to be very firmly. I said, I want to be an actress. Mm hmm. And so that I was only little, it’s not like that was a well thought through, you know, intellectual response. It was just me, I want to be this. And I described that as my pre squashed self, if you like, just that’s it. You’ve asked me that question. That’s what I want to be. I loved dressing up, I loved make believe that dinner. But then we go forward to the sort of early teens in my post squashed self. Yes. And you asked me, What did I want to be? And my answer is a little bit sad. Because my answer would be I wanted to be wanted. Not quite as enthusiastic as the first pre squashed me. I wanted to be wanted. And I wanted to be somebody that people thought was interesting. But weirdly, to take the dressing up idea, I was now instead of dressing up for fun and make believe I was dressing to please, basically. And that was my sort of complete focus. So everything I did, was pretty much guaranteed to make me not interesting, when What I wanted was the people to think I was interesting.

Achim Nowak  06:23

The notion of the priests, priests, squash self is interesting to me, because many of us has dreams and aspirations. And then other voices come in that say, well, you’ll never be successful at that. Or that too many people who want the same thing. God forbid you’re not talented enough. Or as we get into our fourth and fifth act, you’re too old to do it. But all of this, like Who do you think of starting a business in your 60s, right? And the beauty of owning a dream is just we’re allowed to have any dream you want we want without knowing how we get there. Now you live in Bournemouth, which I’m not terribly good with UK geography, but that’s the southwestern part. It’s an ocean town. And when I think of an Olivia, your story you you did become an actress. And you worked as an actress for for a while. I did talk a little bit about what that looked like what kind of acting you did, what kind of decisions you had to make about acting.

Trisha Lewis  07:40

It was full of transitions. So it started I So very briefly, the whole thing I think was born. When I was described as being shy as I was scrolling through my 12 1314 I actually now don’t think that I was shy, I think that was exactly what happens when you squash yourself. And you’re so confused about what you’re allowed to let out that you end up in an internal battle. And in fact, the outward display does look a bit like you’re really shy. So I’ve thought that went through. But that’s in hindsight. So I was advised to do elocution. At school, I went to a posh school. And we did elocution. And that meant reciting poetry. And that gave me a real buzz of realizing theists I am really good at and I could, I could learn lines very easily. So that was my first little taster. And whenever I then I did Shakespeare in as a as a youngster and all sorts of stuff. And then bit of you know, amram stuff. And every time I was there doing something on the stage, I felt like I existed. And when I was off the stage sad that may be I I didn’t quite so fast forward. Weirdly, I dropped all the acting stuff at the very time that I should have gone further into it, if only for my own enjoyment I should have done. And so it was there was this whole gap with no acting. And then a big transition in my personal life led me to take it up again in an amateur form for my sanity. Then I realized Yes, hang on, hang on. Hello. We’re back in a good place. And I worked with some really good directors even in the amateur, as is often the case, space and thoughts. I’m going to take this one step further and sort of go go professional if you’d like. So, in the first instance it was touring theatre fringe theatre, as we call it, all those funny little pub theatres in London where, you know, you’re playing to three people and all you know, there was a bit of a person that was a bit of Pinto there was a whole mix But a plan to even and then the next transition came when I had to be very proactive about the whole direction I was going with it because of family, kids, etc. And this was a big moment for me Actually, when I had a two sort of smallish kids that I would do my own play. So I created wrote, got funding for got a director for etc, etc, arranged a tour and did a one woman play, got my equity card, which in those days was quite a sort of big badge. Now, and I made it work for me. So because it was a one woman play, I could arrange the rehearsals etc, and still juggle the rest of my family life around it a bit. And, and from there, it took on a whole new dimension, because then I thought, I can blinking or do these one woman, I can stand and command snot, it’s all on my own without them going forward. So I started to create a number of one woman plays and shows, some of them entertaining, most of them entertaining. And then I discovered, thanks to the death of my father, believe it or not, he had said something after a show that I after this one woman showed said to somebody else, but not to me, which is fairly typical of that generation. He’d said that I reminded him of somebody called Joyce Grenfell, now, she was around in the 60s 70s, comedic actress, bit like Victoria wood, bit of Alan Bennett dropped in there, you know, people observer fabulously interesting character monologues, etc. Anyway, when I had this repeated back to me by the person that was sold, it clicked, I went off and research this woman. And I created a series of one woman shows of her life and her work, and that I did for 20 years. And in fact, I still do it.

Achim Nowak  12:07

You described that sense of when you use the term a liveliness that you feel onstage and when you’re in character, and many artists have that relationship to that craft. And you also describe how you for a while denied yourself that pleasure. But describe to our listeners who are not actors. Can you describe in more granular way, like what that does for you, that feeling of creating a character of being in stage, their relationship to the audience, paint a picture of how that feels to Trisha Lewis.

Trisha Lewis  12:47

I like the research phase of the whole thing that that appeals to the part of my brain which has the kind of detective thing going on, I like rummaging around trying to find these characters and and the place where it feels right. That’s that’s like a massively fun adventure. As far as I’m concerned, it’s, I love the rehearsal process. I like being I take direction well, and I enjoy being told to try things out differently, and all of that stuff. And then there is this thing called flow, which for me is a is a really good place to be because I’m a bit of an over thinker, you know, creatively sort of too much going on in my head, inclined to then start catastrophizing or worrying about future etc. So to be in the moment. But to me, the amazing thing about being on stage and this is, interestingly, slightly different with a one woman play as opposed to being you know, in an ensemble, you’re working on more than one level. And I just love that feeling. It’s a bit like skating. in one respect, it’s got like, a lovely sort of edge of danger, because there are things that could happen out of your control, you know, in the audience, the building the set, I don’t know something. Does that make sense?

Achim Nowak  14:16

It does. One of my favorite books of all time is called flow the psychology of optimal experience by me Helge chick sent me, Howie, yes. And when we get into flow states, which usually involved we’re so committed to what we’re doing, which is what happens in these magical acting moments, that we lose all all sense of time. And we wish it could go on forever. And at the same time, what I heard you say is wrong. There’s a sense of a sense of power we have that we can be in the moment and at the same time, influence the moment, right. One reason I think actors get hooked on acting is not the fame and the fortune is that experience that feeling? Which seems to feel better than the more mundane aspects of life, right? We’re going to get to Trisha now. And the evolution of that, which is really interesting to me. But one more question because I, you know, I was a professional theater director acting coach for 12 years. And and I was blessed to do quite well in that in that work, but that one of the deep questions that I think actress struggle with, but everyone who’s listening to us who is not an actress struggles with as well. I was a theatre person in Washington DC. The question always was, well, if you’re really serious, you have to be on Broadway in New York, or you have to be in films or television, LA, even though there was a great professional theater scene in Washington, DC. But it was almost implicit if you’re, if you think you’re really good. And if you’re really serious about your career, you got to get your butt out of here. And you got to play big. So there are lots of assumptions around success, and the inner satisfaction the work in it, and I’m sure you must have felt those living not in London living in Bournemouth. So I can’t imagine you weren’t confronted with what does success look like as an actor slash actress living in Bournemouth? How did you work that out for yourself?

Trisha Lewis  16:36

Yes, I had a very direct experience of doing the London thing because one of the place that I created from scratch and I got some arts funding for in all sorts, and I decided, because of this kind of pressure, if you like, I thought, I must go and do it in London. And so I booked three weeks at the Battersea Arts Center, which was quite a nice place. But very, you know, you kind of made it if you’ve got a good shirt that but of course, I was very green, because they put me in the smallest theater, they didn’t do my marketing, which they promised to do. To be honest, I was just naive. And that was the most that was a low, that was a real low. I mean, I stuck it out because you have to, but it was fairly lonely and depressing. And yet, when you compare that to the joy of all the various extraordinary random little tours and places I’ve turned up in, in village halls, and gardens, all over the country with absolute delight, then that, to me, says quite a lot.

Achim Nowak  17:49

Beautifully said, I had so many memories, as he described these various places, you’ve performed them, because I have my own version of that. And when I was in those places, I didn’t always appreciate that. Because at the time, I still always felt like, these are in lies, but there’s still the wrong places. And I think all of us have the story about what’s the wrong place in the right place. And sometimes we get the story mixed up. And any thoughts on this? Trisha?

Trisha Lewis  18:21

Well, yeah, cuz it was funny, the repeat a repeated thing that came out of the mouth of my audiences at these various smaller venues. You know, because I got to meet them. That’s the other thing I got to meet my audiences, which you don’t always in bigger theater productions. So that was a that was lovely. But they will continuously say things like, Oh, my God, you should be on television. This was genuinely a phrase that came out. And this is a very interesting one to filter through your brain. Because, right, on one level, you’ve just done something really good. That has created that reaction from somebody, right? So you should just think I’ve just performed well, and everyone’s happy, this is great, you know, go me, instead of which your brain starts going into this strange place where it says, All honor, that’s right. I’m not on television. I’m a failure. And I can never be in one of those kind of panties because they can’t put as seen in you know, the name of some soap opera or something. Right? You know, and somehow that how can that possibly be a badge of something great and so called success, you know, what were two appearances in a in a long standing soap opera as opposed to 20 years of treading the boards and all that that involves, but your brain so quickly tricks you It’s so quickly tricks you.

Achim Nowak  19:53

Here’s a word from our sponsor. That’s me. I invite you to check out my fourth act. Come. There’s a whole other world of fourth act conversations going on beyond this podcast, my fourth act.com, please take a look. How did you go from doing your one moment performances all over the place? Having encounters with your audiences to then saying at some point, well, I, I think I’d be a really good communications coach. And I think I want to launch a business. I think I can help people who are not actors. Describe how that evolved. And then, which I think is most interesting for our listeners, because we all have similar our versions of that thought. And then it takes courage to act on the thought. Would you describe that to us?

Trisha Lewis  20:57

Yeah. So you’re right, I could have very comfortably carried on doing what I was doing. I kind of developed a bit of a portfolio career actually, because I was doing the little mini plays the 111 show speaking engagements after dinner speak. Or I then also got involved with working with people with dementia during reminiscence B, the shows are just lovely hands on sessions, which was the most beautiful experience 10 years, in and out of hundreds of care homes was Whoa, I did that I also trained as a funeral celebrant Believe it or not, which again, brings in the storytelling, the being able to get people relaxed enough to be able to share the story of their loved one and all that instant trust things, all this was going on. I had also gone to uni as a mature student at the age of 48. And done a degree Bachelor of Arts honors degree in communication. in one respect, I could see that there was everything was linked, and there was this kind of communication stuff going on all over the place. But the real, the real kick that got me to make this crazy move at 59 was that I, I really wanted to make things uncomfortable for myself, again, I wanted to slay a little bit of a demon that had carried with me forever. I think as a result of having a very charismatic, successful businessman, Father, and a not very happy mother. And somehow I, I associated being a business person, potentially even making money, actually. But that’s a bit deep and psychological with something not good. It was that was the evil world. That was where you went if you didn’t want any love and joy and laughter in your world somehow I don’t know. So I thought blow this, I have not going to be defeated. I’m coming up to 60. It’s, you know, let’s do this. Let’s just do this. So I originally thought that I would make this very subtle transition from being a speaker on a more sort of community based entertaining circuit after dinner will add into the business world, I thought, well, I’ll just become a keynote speaker, which was very naive. I soon realized that that wasn’t quite as simple as I made it sound. So I then thought, No, let’s, let’s build this. Let’s take on some clients, let’s work with people. And that started to evolve. But then I had to do things like business networking, which I’d never done before. And I was thrown into a place that I couldn’t have felt more uncomfortable in. Every inch of my body was screaming, you know, don’t do this to yourself. Go back to what you were doing when people said lovely things to you. And it was all warm and Huggy. And the reason was that I went back to not owning any of me, I suddenly thought I had to be a certain way again. So it was it was horrendous. And I got attacked by all your imposter syndrome stuff you can imagine. And I took a very proactive stance on that, which I’m quite proud of. And I thought, Okay, this is real, this is happening, but I’m not going to give up. So I’m going to talk about it. So I started putting together talks about it and workshops about it. And then of course everyone came out of the woodwork saying they felt the same. And that then put me into a much better place where I thought you know, people want me to be honest here. And the more clients I work with, the more I realized everyone was juggling with all these these things. Yeah, then I got to the next transition point, which was finding the right community around the right networking groups and coming out as me

Achim Nowak  25:01

A lot of questions swirling through my brains. But let me go with this one first. I love the notion of stepping into discomfort and continuing to do it. At the same time, part of getting older, and perhaps wiser is knowing this is healthy discomfort, this will move me forward or this feels wrong because I friggin shouldn’t be doing this. Like, well, how do you discern between healthy discomfort and discomfort because it’s just the wrong the wrong play.

Trisha Lewis  25:38

There were certain things which were wrong. So what I began to be able to figure out the bits that were wrong and they were to do with the places I was turning up in, and the slightly bland message that I was putting out there. And the way I was showing up that that was what the wrong bit was, but the core of it the desire to help people communicate better and to bring their real selves out as that developed about that was the bit and people people people I’d love people so that bit was was totally right. So I, every time I thought I’m giving up, I kind of went through a process of Hang on a minute, what am I going to do if I want am I going to do if I give up? Oh, I’ll go back and do the stuff I was doing before and then I I just examined my emotions when I went through that process and my emotions were telling me huh, Sasa a bit of a that’s not you Come on, but I would not have forced myself. I’m the kind of person I mean, I continue Honestly, I am on my third marriage. I came I don’t I don’t stick with stuff forever in a day. It doesn’t feel right.

Achim Nowak  27:01

Oh, husband number three before born. I want to get to your book and investigator Lewis. Investigator Louis is this Alter Ego you created. She shows up on social media a lot. She harks back to your wonderful acting talents. But she also allows you to deliver messages in a fun, quirky, totally enjoyable way. Talk to us about investigator Lewis, and what you love about playing investigator Lewis.

Trisha Lewis  27:48

And interestingly, just to add to that little story I we didn’t delve into we don’t need to Louis funnily enough is the second name of my first husband. So I’m quite pleased about the fact that I held on to it because it was my equity name. It was my actual name. And it was an I quite like it. And I asked my current husband if he was okay. He didn’t feel like alienated by me and he said Honestly, I actually think of you as Tricia lose it’s fine. But what is quite a nice thing now is that I’ve empowered this the Lewis work into something that I own so I I’ve actually done some quite good work there. Anyway, I accidentally I think I’ve always been a sort of frustrated detective Okay, if I had to choose another if I could turn the clock back chosen other career, I would have gone into kind of forensic, you know, stuff and all that malarkey without the danger, which I don’t know if that exists, but I would have loved that sort of resist that researching brain of mine that finding things adventure brain so the detective character was quite was quite natural, but I did it really accidentally, I picked up a hat one of those old fashioned trilby hairs I had, from doing a play ages ago, walked in to the front of my camera and tripod and literally just put the hat on and gave this communication tip in the voice of a sort of private investigator. Everybody really reacted very well. And then I took it one step further and got the trench coat and the dark glasses and it became a thing but but the actual real birth of that happened because of my released self, which happened by involving myself with communities that felt good. Growing as I was growing my business, and sitting at a conference one day with two people one I knew a bit from online, the other I didn’t know at all. This person introduced us knowing that we’d have something in common because she also used quite key characters for her branding and was a bit nuts. And it was lovely. And he introduced us we had a fabulous laugh over lunch. And I said this thing about how I’d like to get more of the kind of actor side of me out there. But somebody told me when I first started business, nobody wants to know about your history as an actor, which course was terrible advice. And they said, Oh, for goodness sakes, do it, Trisha. And we had this great laugh, and it released that part of me. I thought, you know, what, what’s, what’s to lose? So the minute I’d literally press go, and it had gone up on LinkedIn, I sort of committed to this. And lo and behold, it was the absolute pivot, it was the absolute turning point to where I am now. No question. Yeah. So it was it was you could say it was brave. But on the other hand, I’m an actor. So in many ways, it wasn’t that brave. It was. It was more natural. You know, it was fun. I suppose the brave thing was when people completely never take me seriously again. But of course, that wasn’t what happened. So yeah.

Achim Nowak  31:03

Well, to me, to me, it was a release of stuff that you’ve done for 30 years and are really good at and not questioning it. And at the same time, in the story, you told the release came? Because in a way, somebody gave you permission, just do it already. And I find it can be very helpful to have people around SSA just do it already. At the same time. It behooves us to develop that voice within ourselves that says, instead of don’t do it, like, Why the heck not right. How? How would you say? Can people help finding that voice inside of themselves? Instead of waiting for somebody else to say it to us?

Trisha Lewis  31:54

I think you’ve got to understand the amount of illusions that you’re bombarded with and that is the stuff the definitions this the all the sweat,

Achim Nowak  32:07

why not? Trisha? I’m releasing you to swear you’re released.

Trisha Lewis  32:14

Can I say politics then? Okay, let’s say out there in terms of so if you’re constantly listening in business to you must be this, you must be that this is how you do it. Oh, look, I’m looking at these YouTube videos of these people who are making goodness and so much money. And this is how you do the top five tips and all the rest of it. You utterly forget the you. Okay? This is where comparison nighters as we call it comes in and all of that stuff and people pleasing and the whole kitten caboodle. So the first step is when you is to spot yourself doing this, and then come back and say, hang on, hang on, hang on. What about me? Me in this story? Don’t Don’t I exist? Yeah, I always advise people who are a little bit reticent to do this. I mean, that’s what a coach does. I mean, that, you know, when I work with clients, I’m, you know, I’m tweaking that bit and bringing it out, and then they try it out and feels good. And once. Once you realize something feels good, then really only logically, the only thing to do is is to go with it. Otherwise you keep throwing away the feel good thing.

Achim Nowak  33:26

Yeah. I want to talk about the mystery of the squashed self, which is a book that just came out last week. So it’s brand new. What I love about what you’re doing with this book, and it builds on what you just said, it’s it’s not another book on business advice. It’s not another typical book on you have to do these five things. If I say this wrongly, please correct me. My sense is that you will be inspired by your alter ego, the investigator. And you use the character and persona to delve into questions, challenges that we all face, but you did it in a whimsical, playful way through a persona that delights you. And so the book is written from that sense of delight and joy. Describe a little bit how because I think it took courage to say no, I’m not going to write this Trisha Lewis, I’m going to be investigator Lewis, who’s writing this book, because people might have said, God, Jesus friggin nuts is lost. So I just described the process of owning this voice in your writing.

Trisha Lewis  34:43

Okay. I knew basically the stuff I wanted to write about. And I knew that not just from my own story, obviously, because that would be a bit self indulgent, but I you know, after after three and a half years, I’ve worked with enough people. I had enough conversations to know this one. wasn’t just my story, okay, this whole squashed thing. So I had read a lot about imposter syndrome. And I had actually written an entire book about imposter syndrome. But I put it on a shelf, because I just thought, nowhere near here. And I wanted this different perspective. So I worked with a book coach. So I did again, have that encouraging voice of somebody who got me. So when I was saying, Are you sure I can go whole hog with this? for business? But the whole, you know, investigator listening? Yes. They kept saying, yes. Shouldn’t I just maybe do it in a bit of work? No. So yes, working with somebody was good. To me, it made complete sense. Because, because the whole character of the investigator is somebody that asks questions, you know, and at the right moment, triggers off responses from these eight small business owners who come to the investigator with their frustrations. So it’s the voice of the business owner, mainly with just these little bits from the investigator. It’s, it’s visual, it’s kind of visceral, it’s got a cat in it as well, who does crazy things, but it the reason for all that is that you’re, you’re put in a set as like a play, and you’re, you’re in a story. And so you’re hopefully living and breathing it, and it’s brought it to life, rather than just sort of words in a list. But then I did something a little bit clever, because I bought another character and call Professor p, who, because I, I like to know what drives our behaviors. And I wanted to bring the story to life, show people what various symptoms would look like that they might not realize what they’re doing. And then take it to somebody who could fill in the research and the all the psychological stuff that goes on in our brain and will drive a lot of these conformity and fears and all the rest of it. So Professor p was born. And they have quite an interesting relationship, the two of them the investigator in the press, but that gave the vehicle for that it also gives structure to the chapters. And then I came, the investigator writes a report and recommendations, which, of course, you know, is out there now as you could try this. And then exercise and nhfb. So it brings it back to the very real individual as well at the end. So I know that writing is a big discipline, and I’ve never done a book before done plays and all the rest of it. So realizing that I was enjoying it because of this approach to it kept me going, you know that that kept the flow and the flow got better and better. And then I went back and I edited it because I’ve got that voice just like you do as an actor. You know, you’ve you’ve done the read through, you’re kind of rehearsing you think now I’ve got it now I’ve got it, I’ve really got the voice, I’m inhabiting this, this person,

Achim Nowak  37:57

you’ve kept it real by trusting that you could have that voice, right. And for our listeners, I’m thinking of the two messages that stand out for me as I’m listening to you, which is one is we move forward by having the courage to step into healthy discomfort. But we also move forward by choosing the path of joy, which for you is the path of acting and playfulness and quirkiness. Would that be correct?

Trisha Lewis  38:26

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Achim Nowak  38:30

As we start to wrap up, based on what you know now about life, and there’s so much more yet to learn. But if you had to the chance to give a little bit of wisdom and guidance to to young Trisha, pre squashed Trisha, what would you say to her?

Trisha Lewis  38:51

Oh, yeah, wow. I came up with a thought about how I, for many, many years was seeking drama. So from that little kid who wanted to be an actress, as we said in those days, specifically, Julie Andrews, and Glenda Jackson, by the way, I continued, I got squashed, but I, I was seeking drama. because that meant that I did crazy, rebellious things and walked away from jobs the minute I got bored with them, and I did a dirty, dirty, dirty, which gave me that drama, but not in any way helpful, really. But that’s fine. It was a journey and I’m not, you know, I’m not regretful of all that. So I guess I would say, you know, get it get out of your head would be one of my big pieces of advice. You know, embrace your curiosity because you’ve got loads of it, you know, really own it. And, you know, understand that people will be interested in you when you’re interested in them. So just keep learning and ask Questions, and be present and explore and enjoy your blinking quirks for goodness sakes, and the drama will come. Because you’ve kind of, you know, you’ve you’ve invited it in in a healthy way, not kind of sorted to fill a gap

Achim Nowak  40:18

in embrace your, your quirks love that. There may be people listening to us who like you have just entered the 60s and they want to explore some other stuff like you have, what kind of guidance would you give them

Trisha Lewis  40:37

not to go out immediately looking to see what everybody else is doing. And then falling down various rabbit holes of, well, somebody else is already doing that, or I won’t be able to do it as well. But to start from a different place, which is, you know, what’s what’s going to give what’s gonna give me that inner smile on a regular basis, even when things are really tough, I’m still gonna be able to pull on something to push me through. Let me go and see if there’s a different way of doing this and not be put off by all those messages saying, That’s not how you do it.

Achim Nowak  41:17

Nice. So as you look to the future, and that could be your own future, the future of your family, your clients, the world. When you think of the word future? What kind of thoughts does Tricia have or what comes up for you?

Trisha Lewis  41:38

I think I want I want there to be this continual tipping, which I feel is really gathering momentum at the moment, tipping from the sort of cliche clique kind of buzz, wordy, clubby sort of place, that people felt that they were something special in into this kind of, Oh, hang on a minute. We’re actually all humans, we’re all humans, we need to just chill out a bit here and get a bit more honest and real. And stop trying to save our face all the time and stop trying to hide behind all sorts of things. Because if we all did it, it’s a typical Emperor’s New Clothes situation. I just want everybody to be the little kid in the crowd a bit more. Again, that doesn’t mean I’m not actually talking about violent protests. I’m talking about with with humor, and with smiles and warmth, but also some assertiveness to just call some of this

Achim Nowak  42:55

out. Beautiful. If our listeners want to find out a little more about Trisha Lewis and what she does, and your book, The Mystery of the squashed self, where should they look for you?

Trisha Lewis  43:11

Okay, it’s very simply www.Trishalewis.com And it’s for some reason spelled with an sh phonetically. That was a trendy thing. I did a while back. And everything’s on there. Everything is linked from there. I turn up mainly on LinkedIn. But I’m also a bit cute on Instagram. I yeah. And the book is on Amazon, and exclusive there for a couple of months, but then it will be in all sorts of other very interesting places beyond that point. Yeah.

Achim Nowak  43:46

Wonderful. I wish you nothing but great success with the book and thank you for this conversation. Bye for now.

Trisha Lewis  44:00

Like what you heard, please go to www.myfourthact.com And subscribe to receive my updates on upcoming episodes. Please also subscribe to us on the platform of your choice. Rate us give us a review and let us all create some magical fourth acts together. Ciao

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